MRB1000 "Wireless N" question

scapla · EVDO User Joined: 05 Feb 2007 Posts: 35

I just bought the MRB1000 because of the enhanced range that Wireless N advertises. But, will my laptop have to have a Wireless N card to take advantage of the increased range?

Thanks, and apologies if this has been answered (couldn't find it with Search).

Hardware · EVDO Heavy User Joined: 07 Dec 2007 Posts: 137

You should still see some range improvement but what will really dictate that is how well your laptop can transmit/receive signal.

It's been tested and shown that the MBR can go wel over 2000 feet without problems, but can your laptop do the same?

firedude · EVDO Junkie Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 433

See the thread below for more discussion on the subject.....

http://www.evdoforums.com/thread8491.html

JoeCHecht · EVDO Junkie Joined: 05 Jan 2008 Posts: 302

Hardware · EVDO Heavy User Joined: 07 Dec 2007 Posts: 137

I agree with you on needing a good 802.11N client to get the best range/performance.

But there is no reason that you can't get excellent in range on an 802.11B or 802.11G device. Those only limit your throughput, the radio frequency and transmission rates are the same, you're range will improve if the MBR1000 has stronger radios or antennas in it.

So the question comes back to your client. If it's an integrated laptop client with poor antenna's or transmission power you won't get the range you could. If it's an external card, or one of the rare internal cards with good controls, you could see excellent increase in range of use.

firedude · EVDO Junkie Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 433

Joe,
I'm afraid I'm still on Jim's side of the table on this one. I agree on the speed theory, but not the range and here is why.....

Now take my two routers.

Linksys WRT54G

Two huge 9 db gain antennas. 3rd party firmware that has allowed me allowed me to crack the transmit power way up near 200. This router for the last 3 years has out performed ANY G device I've ever seen or tried and I went through a lot, D-Link, all of them including the KR1.

MBR1000

"G" router as you call it unless bBoth ends have "N" you don't benefit from anything (N wise). (your words) Now this thing "stock" with 3 small antennas, transmit power set and locked at consumer level allowed by FCC and this thing smokes my 54G by leaps and bounds in the "G" mode. How could that be?? I contribute it to like Jim says after running hard core tests here of my own to the mixed bag of B,G AND N and the method in which it is broadcasted. THIS makes the MRB100 superior to my WRT54G.

There is no way if the MRB1000 hasn't been tampered with (3rd party firmware) that it can be that much more superior. You just can't convince me of it anyway, not after the tests I've conducted myself. Not saying you are wrong or I'm right however you'll have a hard time getting me to the other side of the table here. Again we're dealing with a stock router out of the box and just in the last day ran several comparison tests between it, WRT54G Linksys and my KR1 and this thing (MRB1000) produces way too much more efficiency and performance without any "adjustments" to convince me otherwise. I HAVE to contribute it to the superiority yes of the MBR1000 AND the new enhance mixed broadcast somehow.

I will also give credit and a lot of it to Cradle Point for producing such a fine product and Router. By far it dances circles around any I've owned and that has been many and that's right out of the box yet! Kudos to CP and crew.

Tony

JoeCHecht · EVDO Junkie Joined: 05 Jan 2008 Posts: 302

firedude · EVDO Junkie Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 433

OK Joe. I tuned OFF the N mode. I ran a test with my co-worker here and he is about 3-400' from me. Running in the G mode only he had a 10%+ DROP, not increase but DROP in signal.

I then called my bro back at his office and explained. His exact words were , "look if you aren't going to accept the facts and what I'm telling you then don't ask anymore". He once again reiterated that..."When the router is transmitting in the N or (mixed mode) you ARE benefiting from that in range only, not speed or other N factors. We all agree on that part. So, I saw a degration in range when I switched to G mode and turned the N mode (mixed) off. I strongly invite others to try this and report back here.

I'm still on my side of the table on this. Smile

Theories are OK with me, but seeing first hand goes further. Is there another explanation for the drop in signal at 300' upon turning N (mixed) off? Or a 10% increase by going from G back the N (mixed) mode? Phew! I'm getting the spins here lmao, but flat out those results are hard to argue with and I'm darn sure not going to arguer with my IT engineering bro. There I can't win.

Please again I invite others to run this simple test and report back. With a CPU wireless and at least 300' or so away and check your signal. Now go in and switch the 1000 to G mode only and note any difference and then finally switch back to the N (mixed) mode and see. Please post your results. I am very interested to see the varying results. I've got a special firedude hot sauce that goes very well with crow lol, but what I've done and seen it supports what i and Jim have been saying.

3G if you have conducted such tests please chime in as well.

Tony

JoeCHecht · EVDO Junkie Joined: 05 Jan 2008 Posts: 302

firedude · EVDO Junkie Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 433

Actually Joe I've enjoyed this "debate" with you as you are very knowledgeable and have gained a lot from your posts. Sometimes I like to play the devils advocate and learn from that as well. Smile

Lets see what others come up with. I hope others accept my invitation to run the test I mentioned. I think if nothing else the results would be interesting. Wink

The bowl of Clam Chowder offer is till on!!

Tony

firedude · EVDO Junkie Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 433

MIMO Technology = Speed and Range Enhancement
MIMO technology, a key component in the upcoming Wireless-N (802.11n) standard, uses multiple radios and antennas on a wireless router (MBR 1000) or client adapter to provide improved performance in range and speed. By combining this smart radio and antenna technology with standards-based Wireless-G (802.11g), it has the potential to double the range of wireless coverage compared to using Wireless-G alone. Overlaying the signals of two Wireless-G compatible radios enables the product to utilize signal reflections that confuse other technologies to increase range and reduce dead spots in the wireless coverage area. When used in conjunction with a Wireless-G Notebook Adapter or wireless-G PCI Adapter, it may yield up to six times better.

Now this is from Major Cisco himself. Smile

I rest my case your honor. By the way this seems to coincide with 3G's review and field testing of the MBR 1000 which I thought was a bit phenomenal, but understand the results a bit better now.

scapla · EVDO User Joined: 05 Feb 2007 Posts: 35

Thanks for the replies. I have the 1000 installed and it's definitely a bit stronger than my WRT54G - at least with the 1000 I don't lose the signal in my office, as I did with the 54G. I'm only using a G card. I considered an N card but I'll save the $50 since it works.

JoeCHecht · EVDO Junkie Joined: 05 Jan 2008 Posts: 302

Alex · Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 2:04 am Post subject:

firedude · EVDO Junkie Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 433

Joe,
Yes it is from Linksys (CISCO) and doesn't really matter. Its been out a long long time and is general knowledge among most. It substantiates my point. Yep I substituted MBR1000 for Linksys as not to confuse everyone because we're talking about devices with the "N" mode and the MBR 1000 is one. It doesn't matter what you want to call the device with the N mode and mixed broadcast . You can call it anything you want. The statement explains how the N mode works and how parts of its elements affect the G mode when used in conjunction with the mixed broadcast with G devices.

I had called my bro before posting that statement and asked him. His exact response was "That is way old news" and "the statement as written is correct and general knowledge and you can easily slip any name of a N device you want and it applies". Plain and simple it does increase range without having to have a N device at the other end. yes you'll need to have one to reap all the benefits of N, but not for range. This is why 3G had such a successful range in their testing of the MBR1000 and also explains my results in my own field testing here. I had to laugh when my brother told me why didn't you just call and ask before going through all that and I would have told you what your results were going to be. He says most engineers and IT gurus have known this for some time. In fact he has installed several systems for large based customers based on this fact without having to use N devices on each end as the main thing they were seeking was an acceptable increase in range and even found a bit better overall performance.

Yes the info came from Linksys (CISCO) and the information (concept) is not company/product specific, but an industry standard of sorts. As far as G routers go the best darned router I ever owned and I have owned many is my trusty old Linksys WRT54G. Until now that is. It has been out performed by the MBR1000. Not because the Linksys is no good anymore, but because the MBR1000 uses different technology than my good old 5 year old standby uses.

I'll let this one ride for now as the N technology has already proven its benefit in both the N mode as well as mixed mode enhancing the range with G only devices. That was my point and I stand by that. Over and out lol.

Gotta go open gates for campers so they won't be unhappy campers lol. Top of the day to ya!