Sprint EVDO at 6 miles?

Shorty · EVDO Fledgling Joined: 21 Dec 2006 Posts: 25 Location: KY

I live in the "e-boonies" - too far for DSL, no cable, etc., stuck with 26kbps dialup. I was considering satellite internet, but now EVDO has caught my eye.

I estimate that I'm 6 miles from two different Sprint towers. I'm probably NLOS from one, not sure about the other. I live outside the orange colored region on the Sprint coverage map, but on high ground. What are the odds that I can connect? I don't mind putting up a rooftop antenna (on a 2-story home).

How much signal loss is there with distance? And do download speeds vary with signal strength?

Thanks for any advice,

Shorty, in Kentucky

breethon · EVDO Fledgling Joined: 26 Sep 2006 Posts: 12

I live about 6 miles from the nearest cell tower as well (and also got 26k dialup...lol). I signed up for EVDO but needed an amp to boost my signal so I could connect (no signal without it - but I am not on high ground). With my amp and a 5dbi gain antenna I get about 80% signal (I tether my motorolla E815 to my pc -not a data card) which translates into ~ 500kbps/100kbps consistently. Not sure if this helps or not, as I am new to this whole thing. Smile

Semi75 · EVDO Junkie Joined: 25 Feb 2006 Posts: 240

It may work, it may not. With any radio signal terrain matters a lot, being at a high elevation may help you so it could be worth a shot. I'm in Franklin Co. KY and live about 3-4 miles from where EVDO stops outside of Frankfort. I personally can't pull in an EVDO signal from that distance because of terrain even using an AMP and a yagi or omni antenna. Luckily for me I am right by another tower marked in the future upgrade area.

Anyway depending on who you go with there is a trail period where you can try out the card and see if it works and return it during the trial period if it does not. If you can lock the card in EVDO mode only and get a little hint of an EVDO signal then an exterior antenna will likely help you. Personally I would try it out and only purchase an adapter cable and antenna to test and skip buying an amp unless you really think you need it. There are a lot of people here that know more, but from my experience helping a couple of friends test their locations I have never been able to pull in a signal that wasn't showing up w/ an good exterior antenna by adding an amp in the chain. The amp has aided slightly when in very marginal areas with an antenna. I would have to really need it to purchase an amp again considering the price.

Scott · Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 2:38 pm Post subject:

Couple of things:

breethon's Alltel isn't Shorty's Sprint. That is, 6 miles of 800MHz isn't 6 miles of 1900MHz. Distance, elevation, foliage/hills, and building structure will effect 1900MHz more.

There's also a finite distance for connecting to EVDO vs. 1xRTT, signal level plays a part, but isn't the only player.

Within a mile or so of the fringe of 1900MHz coverage and using a good antenna in an elevated mounting setup may realistically get you EVDO if site conditions let the signal in (but usually the signal is pittering out for a reason... distance or elevation drop or hills, etc).

Six miles from a 1900MHz tower, with iffy conditions, may be a tall order (isn't typical service radius for 1900MHz 3 miles?).

jduthler · EVDO Newbie Joined: 24 Nov 2006 Posts: 6

I also live in the boonies and the map does not always tell the story, so I verified that I could get out of the commitment and just return the kit if the service did work as expected. Sprint offers a 30 day return policy so I took the plunge and no regrets so far, sure beats Wildblue.

Oldbull · EVDO Fledgling Joined: 05 Oct 2005 Posts: 25

I feel your pain, having to deal with dial up is almost unbearable if you do more than light web browsing and email. Until 2 or 3 weeks ago I was in a similar situation, except I was trying to pull in an EVDO signal from 10 to 12 miles away. Eventually through 8 months of trial and error and lots of money spent on antennas, amps, cables and adapters I was able to finally secure a usable signal......a whole week before they turned EVDO on at my local tower. The final solution for me ended up being a TV satellite dish mated to a 13 db flat panel antenna, 40 foot of ultra low loss cable and a 3 watt amp ( Maximum Signal Model ). This setup was usable but by no means totally satisfactory and it became more of a quest for me than anything else. The expense was totally out of wack compared to the performance I was receiving, upload speed was especially weak and erratic.

You didn't specify, but I assume you will be using a notebook card such as the S720 instead of a cell phone as modem. With that being said I can offer some advice about what I would do in your situation.

Living in a fringe area, be sure you purchase a card with an external antenna port.

If you intend to use the card in a desktop computer instead of a laptop make sure you have an approved pci adapter in hand or on the way, sucks to burn up 5 or 6 days of your Sprint trial period waiting on parts, especially as slow as the mail is during the Christmas season.

Take the plunge and bring all the new stuff home from the local Sprint store and install it in your computer. After making sure everything works lock the card into EVDO only and see if you get a signal at the place you normally will be using the computer.

If you can get a signal of -105 db or less from inside the home with no external antenna at 5 to 6 miles from tower I would bet you stand an excellent chance of eventually pulling in a decent signal...all it takes is money.

If you can't get an EVDO signal at your normal workstation, move your laptop or desktop in front of a window on tower side of your home, a signal there is a good thing if your at least -105 without external antenna, an antenna and or amp will really help. Taking your laptop outside may help you get a signal but I usually see little difference standing outside with my laptop compared to just standing at the window.

I know I keep tossing that -105 signal strength around, its just my rule of thumb I guess. My experience has been that if my system can "see" a signal of about -105 to 108 db un-assisted I have always been able to improve it to near -90 db with external antenna and/or amp.

In your situation, if I could get any sign of a signal I would utilize a panel antenna on the side of your home ( or window ) that is facing your best signal source. Recently I have been using a 13 db model, at the moment I don't recall the name of the company I purchased it from, but this particular unit is sold by several vendors at various prices from $50 to $80. It is easily found doing a google search similar to " 1900 mhz panel antenna". It is apx 12" x 12" and the cable connection on the back is TNC-female. Quality and performance seems ok, there are not many inexpensive panel antennas out there to choose from.

Other antenna's that I have had good luck with are the Wilson Trucker also $50 to $80 at various retailers and a homebuilt Bi-Quad antenna I made from plans easily found on the internet.

I don't even pretend to be any kind of expert in this stuff, I've just done a lot of trial and error and spent a ton of money on this stuff. Our current situations sound close enough that I'm sharing in the hope that what worked for me can work for you with less trial and less money spent.

You are about 6 miles from Sprint tower, I am about 4.5 miles. You are on a hill with what sounds like 1 good chance at partial LOS to a tower, I have lots of trees to go through to my tower so you may have the advantage even with the greater distance to tower. I am 1.5 miles from the "gold" EVDO area as per the Sprint map.

Inside my home I receive an unassisted EVDO signal of about -98db. Using the Wilson Trucker mounted on the roof with 30' of RU58 coax ( I know 30' of this cable is crap, but it's what I currently have to work with ) I pull a -88db EVDO signal. Using the Panel antenna placed in the window next to my computer , using 10' of Ru58 I get a signal of
-85db. The homebuilt Bi-Quad in the same window with the same cable and connectors will get me down to -80.

Attaching the 3 watt amp to either the Panel or Bi-Quad antenna will drop my signal into the lower 70's, but actually the -80 I'm getting with the Bi-Quad in the window seems fine so I don't even bother hooking up the amp any more. My area currently has a low EVDO user base I think and I constantly get 1000 to 1200k down and 100 to 125k up with my -80db signal.

I'm very happy so far with EVDO and this setup, even though I probably have over $600 in gear just lying around that I am no longer using.....can't decide if I want to laugh or cry about that.

Anyway this turned out to be way longer than I intended, maybe I try to explain too many things. I guess the short version is " I think you have a good chance of success ".

Last thing, if you can't get an EVDO signal, 1xRTT is really not that bad unless your a gamer. It is at least 4 or 5 times faster than dial up in my opinion.

Good Luck

n6gn · Posted: Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:41 am Post subject:

Shorty · EVDO Fledgling Joined: 21 Dec 2006 Posts: 25 Location: KY

Thank you to everyone for all the info... I'm encouraged by some of the comments I've read, e.g.

n6gn · Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 11:49 am Post subject: Re: Sprint EVDO at 6 miles?

Bigdave · EVDO Addict Joined: 08 Nov 2006 Posts: 1069

Sexxxy Beast · EVDO Newbie Joined: 19 Mar 2007 Posts: 6

I currently connect at 26k too...

On the verizon coverage map i am about 1500ft away from the pink spot where they say they have signal. I am also about 2.3 miles away from the area which is completely pink, and apparently 4.2 miles away from an actual tower (behind the hill). Do you think i can get evdo access? if so, is it going to be worth the $40-60 dollars?

I also know of a 2 way sat service for $40, with $200 in equipment, maybe thats a better choice?

sirwoogie · EVDO User Joined: 07 Feb 2007 Posts: 32 Location: MI

Llama · Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:42 am Post subject:

As a former 8+ year satellite user, please don't get satellite if you have any option than dialup. I am in an unknown signal strength zone from Sprint's maps and get Rev A. The nearest tower is just under 3 miles with the next one just over 5 miles, but their lobes must be oriented other directions than my dead zone.

Satellite may give you faster downloads (at times and for a limited amount of throughput usually), but 10x latency (with satellite return) and slower uploads. $40 does not sound bad because I was paying $70 and the equipment was ~$500-$800 with DirecWay/HughesNet.
_________________
--Larry

xrayman · Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:36 am Post subject:

Llama is dead on about satellite internet. I have 6 months to run on my 24 month contract with WildBlue satellite internet. Service was not too bad at first, then as the beams got filled up the speed went down hill. At times I was only getting 300kbps down and 10kbps up speed tests during prime time. At this time my WB service has improved, close to advertised down/up speeds for my package during off peak times. Ping times for any satellite service will be long, WildBlue started out around 600ms. At this time it is around 1500ms at good times and during peak times it will test much longer. This delay makes for long loading times for complex web pages and other services.
WildBlue has just begin to roll out service on a new satellite. This new service will also be sold under other brand names, AT&T, EchoStar, DirecTV, NRTC, etc. To start with service most likely will be good on this new bird till the spot beams are close to full. Bottom line is if you can get any other type of broadband internet service get it before you jump into a satellite contract.

deparson · EVDO Junkie Joined: 30 Aug 2006 Posts: 249

I would second the oppinion to NOT use a home made antenna unless you are a really crack antenna builder/designer with some solid experience.

Spend the extra money to get a ready made unit that you know will work correctly. I would be a shame to conclude that your setup won't work only for an incorrectly tuned antenna.

-D